Stat of the Week...Top 15 in percentage of starts won since 1952 (min. 120 wins): 1. Warren Spahn 53.9%... 2. Juan Marichal 52.1%... 3. Ron Guidry 51.7%... 4. Whitey Ford 51.2%... 5. Roy Halladay 51.0%... 6. Pedro Martinez 50.9%... 7. Johan Santana 50.8%... 8. Bob Gibson 50.8%... 9. Sandy Koufax 50.6%... 10. Mike Mussina 50.4%... 11. Jim Palmer 50.3%... 12. Roger Clemens 50.1%... 13. Randy Johnson 49.9%... 14. Andy Pettitte 49.9%... 15. Jim Maloney 49.6%...
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Showing posts with label Greatest Southpaws. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Greatest Southpaws. Show all posts

Bill James Ranks The Lefties

Posted by Gator Guy on Saturday, February 20, 2010 , under | comments (0)



Bill James ranked the 100 greatest pitchers in baseball history in The New Bill James Historical Baseball Abstract. The book was written after the 1999 season (and ultimately published in 2001) and consequently greats like Roger Clemens, Greg Maddux, Randy Johnson, Pedro Martinez and Mariano Rivera are not as elevated in James's rankings as they would be today (ranking 11th, 14th, 29th, 49th and unranked, respectively). Based on more recent commentary by James I think it's pretty clear that Randy Johnson, in particular, would make a huge jump in James's ranking.

Here is James's list of the top 20 southpaws of all time through 1999 (my list is here; open it up in a new window and do a side-by-side comparison of the lists):

A pretty good list, Mr. James. Bill's list is based on his Win Shares analyses, which combine career Win Shares, top three Win  Share seasons, Win Shares over the pitcher's best five consecutive seasons and career Win Shares per season. Accordingly, Bill has Sandy Koufax ranked ahead of Steve Carlton despite having barely half Carlton's career Win Shares.

Bill's top 10 would look pretty much the same today, I believe, with two exceptions: Randy Johnson would jump ahead of Koufax and probably even Spahn, taking the two spot behind Grove; and Glavine would likely crack the top 10 given his superior 2000 to 2002 seasons (55-27, 133 ERA+).

It's harder to speculate about what Bill's second 10 would look like today. Bill and his buddy Rob Neyer seem to think fairly highly of Andy Pettitte (Bill has said Andy will likely make the Hall of Fame, and Neyer has said that Andy is "qualitatively" better than Jack Morris). And Johan Santana is probably already on the cusp of Bill's second 10. However, the presence of Wilbur Cooper and Eppa Rixey on Bill's list suggests to me that he perhaps adhered too slavishly to his Wins Shares index, and I don't think either Pettitte or Santana fare too well on that basis (although Santana will certainly get there with another four or five good years).

Bill has seven pitchers ranked ahead of Guidry who I'd ranked behind: Plank, Newhouser, Waddell, Cooper, Pierce, John and Kaat. Conversely, Bill has Gomez ranked one spot behind Guidry whereas I had ranked Gomez one spot ahead of Guidry. The difference between our approaches to Plank and Waddell is easily explainable: I copped out and argued that it was simply to difficult to compare "deadball era" pitchers to post-1920 era pitchers. As for the rest, this is my take on Bill's take:

Newhouser.  Bill seems to hold Prince Hal in unusually high regard. It's not clear to me how Bill weights the War Years, but it seems as if he doesn't discount them as much as I do. He also made a couple of very strange claims about Newhouser's post-War Years in his Historical Baseball Abstract, arguing that Newhouser was the best pitcher in the AL in '47 and '48. Well, it was Feller in '47 and, for my money, either or both Gene Bearden and Bob Lemon were better than Hal in '48 (I admit, Hal's and Lemon's numbers in '48 are pretty damn similar, but Lemon pitched TEN shutouts, and that tipped the balance to Bob). Anyway, I had Prince Hal 14th on my list of post-1920 lefties.

Cooper.  Cooper was good, and very consistent, between '16 and '24, but I think Bill's ranking of Cooper is a case of too much reliance on the Win Shares analysis. Also, while consistency is certainly a virtue, Bill seems to value it more highly than I do. See the discussion of Jim Kaat, below. Cooper was honorable mention on my list (i.e., not in the top 15).

It's difficult to tell what Bill thought of Cooper, with Cooper's mini-bio in Bill's Abstract consisting only of two extended quotes from two other writers that dealt more with Cooper's personality than his pitching.

Pierce.  I, too, am a Billy Pierce fan (perhaps I just fancy slightly built lefthanded power pitchers), but he barely missed my list of the top 15 post-1920 lefties. Here are my two reservations regarding Billy.

First, in considering his excellent W-L record during his peak (i.e., '51 to '60) you have to recall that the White Sox had some very good teams in those years. In fact, the White Sox had a cumulative .568 winning percentage over that decade; Billy managed a .584 winning percentage over that period. That's not much of a difference.

Second, Billy seemed to disappear a bit on the Chisox down the stretch of those '50s pennant races. Take his great '55 season, for instance (1.97 ERA, 199 ERA+). The White Sox were half a game up on the Yanks and 1.5 games up on the Indians when Billy took the mound against the Indians on Sept. 3, but he gave up 8 hits and 6 walks in 5.1 innings and lost, 6-1. A week later he faced the Yanks and couldn't make it out of the 2nd inning,  giving up 6 runs in 1.1 innings. Ten days later, with the White Sox now five games back of the Yankees but still alive, Billy lost to the Indians and Early Wynn, 3-2, eliminating the Sox from the pennant race.

In 1953 the Sox were just 6.5 games back of the Yanks after Billy shutout the Tigers on August 14th, but Billy won only two more game the rest of the way, and his second win was on the last day of the season, long after the Sox had been eliminated.

In '57 the Sox were staying within striking distance of the Yanks through August and September (between 4 and 6.5 games back for most of those two months), but Billy went only 5-5 with a 5.04 ERA in August and September, after taking a 15-7 record and 2.45 ERA into August. He was hammered in both his starts against the Yanks down the stretch, giving up 9 earned runs in 10.1 innings.

And when the Sox finally won the pennant in '59 Billy struggled down the stretch, winning only two games in August and September. It was the same story in '60 - the Sox were right there with the Yanks and Orioles in August and September, but Billy pitched very poorly over his last 8 starts (ironically, the Sox won six of those starts anyway, despite Billy averaging less than 4.5 innings per start and posting a 5.14 ERA).

I don't think these late season swoons figured into Bill's analysis at all. They figure into mine, however, and they exerted a pretty heavy drag on Pierce's ranking in my list of all-time lefties.

John.  Honorable mention on my list. He was a big winner when healthy for the Dodgers and Yanks in the late '70s and in 1980. And he was consistently good even during his abbreviated seasons. But there were just too many seasons when he didn't make enough starts, didn't pitch enough innings, and therefore didn't have enough impact.

Kaat.  Bill has an extended take on Kaat in the Abstract, and emphasizes how consistent Kaat was during the '60s and '70s. It's true, Kaat was very consistent, but he was too often consistently mediocre from '68 to '73, during a period that should have been the peak of his career (ages 29 to 34). I've lauded Kaat in this blog - for his back-to-back 20 win seasons for poor White Sox teams in '74 and '75, and for his spectacular stretch run in the great four-team pennant scramble of '67 - but I had Kaat ranked 15th on my list of post-1920 lefties, five spots behind Guidry.

All in all, I think Bill's list is pretty similar to mine. And even if Bill is right and Guidry is the 14th best post-1920 southpaw rather than the 10th, I still think he belongs in the Hall.

The Greatest Southpaws In American League History

Posted by Gator Guy on Friday, May 29, 2009 , under | comments (0)













I suggested in this post that Ron Guidry may be the fourth greatest lefthander in the modern (i.e., post-1920) history of the American League, behind only Grove, Ford and Gomez. The more I look at it, the clearer the case becomes. The only other lefthander who might conceivably crack the top four is Randy Johnson, whose AL statistics are remarkably close to Guidry's. Let's look at the Guidry/Johnson comparison, and rank the top 10 southpaws in modern AL history.

In ten seasons with the Mariners and two with the Yankees Johnson compiled a 164-93 record, .638 winning percentage, and a 3.60 ERA (a 122 ERA+). He spent his first four seasons with the Mariners learning his craft and struggling to assert control and mastery over his outrageous stuff, a high '90s fastball and wickedly biting slider. He blossomed in 1993 and by 1995 was clearly the best pitcher in the AL, posting an 18-2 record in the strike-shortened season and winning the Cy Young Award (taking 26 of 28 first place votes). He missed almost the entire 1996 season with arm troubles but rebounded in 1997 with a 20-4 record and 2.28 ERA. Only Roger Clemens' triple crown season prevented Johnson from winning a second Cy Young Award. Johnson's impending free-agency and negotiations with the Mariners seemingly distracted Johnson in 1998 and he struggled to a 9-10 with Seattle before being traded to the D'backs and completely dominating the NL over the last two months of the season. He returned to the AL in 2005 at the age of 41 and spent two seasons with the Yankees, going 34-19 with very mediocre ERAs.

Johnson's AL record is almost identical to Guidry's - six fewer wins than Guidry and two more losses - for a .638 winning percentage that ranks behind only Ford, Grove, Guidry, Gomez and Pettitte since the inception of the AL in 1901. His dominance of the AL for four full seasons between '93 and '97 (a five year stretch that includes Johnson's very abbreviated season in '96) closely mirrors Guidry's domination of the AL for the three period between '77 and '79: Johnson was 75-20 (.789 win%) with a 162 ERA+; Guidry was 59-18 (.766 win%) with a 161 ERA+. Johnson won one Cy Young Award and had two second place finishes and one third, as compared to Guidry's first, third and seventh place finishes between '77 and '79.

Johnson's period of dominance in the AL was slightly longer than Guidry's, and that's a plus for Randy. But Randy's AL career was rather shallow aside from those four seasons, and none of his other AL seasons placed him among the AL's premier pitchers. Johnson played nine full seasons in the AL ('89, '96 and '98 were all partial seasons due to either trades or injury) and the four seasons I've mentioned were the only ones in which he received Cy Young consideration. Guidry had six seasons over a nine-year stretch in which he received CY consideration and his career in the AL is accordingly a little deeper than Johnson's.

What really tilts the decision in favor of Guidry are the post-season and pennant race performances. Johnson participated in three tight divisional races in the AL (with Seattle in '95 and '97 and the Yanks in '05) and was outstanding in all three, going a combined 12-0 in 15 starts with a 2.04 ERA, but his 5-0 September record in '95 was the only one in which his impact on the race approached Guidry's '77, '78 and '85 seasons, in which Guidry led two spectacular Yankees comebacks and one aborted comeback. In '97 Johnson made only three September starts in the Mariner's division title push. Although his victory over the Red Sox on the 2nd to last day of the 2005 season clinched the division title and a playoff spot for the Yankees, his 4 victories in six starts were less significant than Aaron Small's five wins in five starts, which included four straight wins in the first 20 days of September while Johnson was logging two no-decisions in three starts. It was Small's four straight wins while the Yanks overcame a four game deficit in early/mid September that keyed the Yanks' comeback.

Guidry's biggest edge is in the October performances. Johnson won his first post-season start in '95 and picked up another win in relief to clinch Seattle's series win over the Yankees in the ALDS. After that he made six starts in AL post-season competition and went 0-4 with a 5.35 ERA. He pitched well in a relief stint for the Yanks in the last game of the 2005 ALDS, but his failures in his six starts contributed significantly to four series losses by the Mariners and Yankees.

Altogether Johnson was 14-4 in 22 starts in AL pennant races and post-seasons, posting a 2.80 ERA in 157.1 innings. As I've noted, Guidry was an astounding 31-6 in 40 starts in pennant races and the post-season with a 2.74 ERA. Guidry's outstanding 3-1 record and 1.69 ERA in the World Series further cement his edge.

Johnson's amazing NL record vaults him to the top of the ranks of major league lefthanders, behind only Grove in my estimation. His .655 winning percentage in the NL equals Koufax's, and his amazing 158 ERA+ in the NL is probably enough to make him the greatest NL lefthander of all-time, a nose ahead of Sandy. Johnson is plainly the superior pitcher in any comparison of Johnson's career vs. Guidry's, but based purely on their AL records Guidry narrowly wins and places fourth on my list of modern era (i.e., post-1920) AL lefties.

Santana obviously had the potential to move ahead of Guidry among AL lefthanders, and he still might if he ever returns to the AL, but his 93-44 record in the AL and only four full seasons as a starter don't provide enough data. Newhouser might have challenged Guidry's standing, but the fact that two of his three dominant years occurred during the war years hurts his case. Plank and Waddell were great in the pre-1920 era, the best of their time, but it's virtually impossible to make valid comparisons with post-1920 pitchers because of the vastly different nature of the game in the early part of the century.

My top ten modern era AL lefties are, in order, Grove, Ford, Gomez (by a nose over Guidry), Guidry, Santana, Pennock, Pettitte, Newhouser, Kaat and Lopat. Jimmy Key, Billy Pierce and Tommy John narrowly miss the cut. Mark Buehrle and C.C. Sabathia can enter into the discussion with three or four more good years.

It somehow strikes my as very odd that the fourth (or even the fifth or sixth) greatest leftie in modern AL history could be rejected by the Hall of Fame. Veterans Committee, are you listening?

Did the HOF Really Reject the 10th Best Lefty Ever?

Posted by Gator Guy on Saturday, May 16, 2009 , under , | comments (0)




Is it really possible that the tenth greatest lefthander in the modern history of the game was rejected by the Hall of Fame? Is it really possible the Hall rejected the fourth greatest leftie in modern American League history? Put together your list of the premier southpaws in baseball history - mine's on the next page. Just click below to see my ranking of the 15 greatest lefthanders of all time. I'll tell you right now that the five guys pictured above - Hubbell, Spahn, Grove, Johnson and Carlton - all rank near the top.

Here's my list.

I found it difficult to rank pitchers from the pre-1920, "dead ball" era - it was just such a different game before Ruth revolutionized it. But Eddie Plank and Rube Waddell are definitely my top two from the pre-1920 era.
I rate Guidry ahead of three Hall of Fame lefties: Hal Newhouser, Herb Pennock and Eppa Rixey (who is not on my list at all). Had two of Newhouser's great years not occurred during the war years I probably would have rated him ahead of Guidry. Pennock's claim to Fame rests on his great six-year stretch with the Yankees in the 1920's ('23 to '28), which I judged comparable to, but exceeded by, Guidry's nine-year stretch from '77 to '85. As for Rixey, I'm not really sure why he is in the Hall of Fame.

Although Randy Johnson has won more games in the AL than in the NL, his most dominant period came in the NL (including four of his five Cy Young Award wins). Johnson's AL numbers are very similar to Guidry's (slightly fewer wins, lower winning percentage, a small advantage in ERA+), and on that basis I ranked Guidry as the fourth best lefthander in AL history, behind only Grove, Ford and Gomez.

Obviously Johan Santana has the opportunity to move further up this list. Even though Santana has only made 216 starts in his career, he's been the best pitcher in baseball for five years now and shows no signs of relinquishing the title. That's an impressive achievement.

As for the rest of the list, I'm fairly confident about the top three spots, but the four through eight spots - Hubbell, Spahn, Carlton, Ford and Glavine - are very tight, and I could look at these five a week from now and feel differently. For instance, Tom Glavine probably has a credible argument for ranking as high as fifth. I'm certain there are many who would rate Glavine ahead of Ford and maybe even Carlton, just as there are many who would rate Koufax higher than third.

Here are the "honorable mentions", in no particular order: Tommy John, Ken Holtzman, Frank Viola, Mike Cuellar, "Steady Eddie" Lopat, Fernando Valenzuela, Vida Blue, Hippo Vaughn, Jimmy Key, Rube Marquard, Mickey Lolich, Jerry Koosman, David Wells, Eppa Rixey, Jamie Moyer, Billy Pierce, Mel Parnell, Harry Brecheen, Wilbur Cooper and Chuck Finley.